E37 | Anthony Renna: Be Like The Best - Art Of Coaching™

TRANSCRIPT

Brett Bartholomew 0:00

What’s up everybody excited to share this episode with you want to make a quick announcement first, just reminder, this is going to be the last week you guys can sign up for our new apprenticeship event. The Art of Coaching Apprenticeship is a highly, highly interactive two day event focused on social skill development in coaches and leaders of all types. You don’t have to be a strength coach, you don’t have to be a personal trainer, you don’t have to deal with any of that. Nothing. Art of coaching is specific only to strength and conditioning. This is a company that is focused on leadership and leader development. That’s what we believe coaches are they’re leaders. So these apprenticeships, a big reason I created them as I wanted to kind of cure clinic culture. Those of you that go to a lot of clinics have seen it before you line up, you go to these places, and it’s just presenter after presenter after presenter. Maybe you have a couple practicals very few people ever engage. It’s just kind of an information overload and hopefully somebody applies something that they saw or read or listened to on Monday morning. These are different. A big part of it, guys, three fourths of it is interaction, whether that’s in small groups, improv breakout scenarios, all these different things that we’re doing to really evaluate how coaching and communication is done, and most importantly, how it can be improved. So we’re doing this on November 2nd, and 3rd in Madison, Alabama. All details are in the show notes for The Apprenticeship, you can easily find it at artofcoaching.com. Just go to the mentoring section and look up The Apprenticeship. It’s also been something that I’ve announced on my newsletter. So make sure that you go there. And these are things that we do all over the world. So if you’re interested in hosting an apprenticeship, there’s literally no cost to you. You just have to make sure that there’s seating available we have audio video, we have everything there. And then all we require is 10 signups so if you want to host an apprenticeship, you can also do that at artofcoaching.com. Just go to Host a live apprenticeship and we’ll start the process. In the meantime, I hope you guys really enjoy this episode with Anthony Renna. Anthony is a really good friend. He’s got an awesome book coming out. Everybody always asked me for book recommendations. So add his to your list, and I’m gonna let him tell you more about it. So here’s Anthony Renna.

Welcome to the Art of coaching podcast, a show aimed at getting to the core of what it takes to change attitudes, behaviors and outcomes in the weight room, boardroom classroom and everywhere in between. I’m your host, Brett Bartholomew, I’m a performance coach, keynote speaker and the author of the book conscious coaching. But most importantly, I’m a lifelong student interested in all aspects of human behavior and communication. I want to thank you for joining me and now let’s dive into today’s episode

welcome back to another episode of The Art of coaching podcast. This guess was tough to wrangle for a while I think I had to get a certain point in my career to to be quote unquote big time enough to get him on the show. I’m just busting his chops. Anthony Renna. What’s up, buddy?

Anthony Renna 3:05

Right. Thank you so much. I can’t apologize enough for that email that you sent me that I never answered in like 2008 or something.

Brett Bartholomew 3:11

That’s right, man, I get used to it. You know what I should have done. And I’m joking. Of course, this is all said in jest. But you oftentimes hear about people that are like, Oh, I got this rejection letter, and I put it up against a wall. If I had a wall filled with any of the emails and things or things that you know, people didn’t respond to at the time. And you know, it’s probably on me, I probably wrote an email like a jackass, you know, and you had, a lot of stuff going on. But man, I’m so happy to have you on the show. And you have some awesome news coming out. I think that this is really cool. On October 18, you’re coming out with a book be like the best. And tell us a little bit more about this. And I’m gonna dive into some of my favorite parts of it as well. But why the hell did you write a book given that, you know, over 12 years, you’ve been interviewing people like crazy, you’ve owned your own business? Well, why the book?

Anthony Renna 3:56

Yeah, it’s funny because the book really came from the interviews because what I did was when I sold my gym in 2016, to focus on you know, really making in a bigger impact. Like I realized that the strenth coach podcast and strength coach TV and strenghtcoach.com And all of these things like for me, I really got that’s what kind of got me out of bed in the morning. So it was something for me that I really enjoyed, like I love going to perform better and somebody might hear my voice and say no way, you’re the podcast guy, right? I love the podcast you make I’ve learned so much people would tell me for strength coach TV like and I watched all the strength coach TVs before I opened my gym, it was so helpful. That really made me feel good. And then I started to understand like, look, I can make a bigger impact than just training in my local gym, which is the love. I still love kind of doing that, but at the same time, I wanted to make that bigger impact. And so I sold the gym. And as I’m developing my platform, you have a website called my company continues. So is that continuefit.com And you need a lead magnet. Now, for anybody that doesn’t know lead magnet is something that I’m going to give you in exchange for an email address, right? So I said, Well, what do people know me for? They know me for my audio interview. So that is something that I’m going to use and what do I want to interview people, I don’t want to interview them about the X’s and O’s. Because that’s what I do twice a month on the string coach podcast for the last 12 years. So let me do something different. Now my mission, my purpose as I was kind of making this transition, I started to formulate this mission of I want to help fitness professionals become successful and making the impact in the world. And it said, let me do some interviews on success with some a couple of different people in the industry, Don Saladino, great personal brand, Mike Boyle, great sports performance brand. Brian McKee free kind of the trainer to a lot of the strength coaches in college and pro ranks. Jeremy Cooper Smith, who is taught 1000s and 1000s of personal trainers, and Alan Cosgrove the business of fitness. So it was five people kind of similar, but different angles. And I said, Oh, let me interview the monks on success. So I did that. And I thought, Oh, this would be good PDF, then I thought, Wow, this would be a pretty cool book. And I mean, you know, you get, like what Steven Pressfield, who wrote do the work and the Legend of Bagger Vance says, you know, look, you’re gonna fight the resistance. So the resistance came in hard. You’re not an author, nobody wants to hear from you just keep talking on the hill, like get people, interview people just keep doing that. Right. Tim Ferriss done this type of a book already. And then I just kind of fought through that and said, No, I need to do something different. Then that I want to I’m falls in line with my mission and my purpose to help fitness professional become successful and make an impact. So I called 45 more people and said, Hey, I got a book coming out on success. Would you like to be part of it? And everybody kind of agreed no problem. And, and here we are. So that’s how it all started through really through that piece of it. And endowment author?

Brett Bartholomew 7:26

Yeah. Well, and I mean, you touched on that. I mean, everything that you’ve done with the strength coach podcast, I mean, that being the benchmark for the field for so long, and still being you know, I would imagine, like, you guys have to have more listeners in the field and strength and conditioning than almost any other although hopefully I can dethrone you soon here, Anthony. But, you know, then strength coach TV and everything you’ve done with Coach boy, I mean, I kind of feel like what you said with me, when you interviewed me a while back, like if people haven’t heard of you by now, they kind of live under a rock because your voice is your net, although not in a stylistic way. But in a dominance way. You’re kind of the Howard Stern of strength coach, radio, so to speak. And you know, you’ve been able I think it’s funny, you mentioned people, oh, Tim Ferriss has done that. I mean, how much shit has been done before everything’s been done before. If nobody tried to, like create anything new, then what would be the point of any of it. And I think people have done it before. But there’s also things you can’t relate to, I’ll say this. And I hope to meet Tim Ferriss someday, I’m sure he’s a lovely person. And, and we’d engage in discussion, but like, and I’d say this, frankly, to Tim, if he asked for this feedback, as great as it is to hear from the things like, you know, these billionaires and these leaders and other industries and things like that I’ve done, I don’t always relate to that. You know what I mean? I don’t always relate to guys that, that have certain situations, and I don’t always want to hear from them. And a big reason I started my podcast, is I wanted to continue to give a voice to the people still kind of add, you know, the grindstone and that’s not to say none of the people, you know, Tim Ferriss interviews, people like Walter Isaacson and all that people that continue to put out prolific amounts of work and things. But again, there’s still things that your audience and your niche and they people want to hear from that. And, you do have a who’s who I mean, you have David Kenny and Eric Cressey, Mike, of course, you have Brijesh Patel Don Saladino, great guy, great cook. I mean, there’s no shortage. And I would venture to say that people in our field, or even people in other fields would sometimes relate more to these guys than they would the CEO entrepreneur, you know, like would you agree with that? Like, have there been things because no doubt you’ve read books like that. Did you ever find yourself feeling like yeah, these tips are great, but I still feel like I’m searching for something else.

Anthony Renna 9:43

Brett I’m so glad you said that. That is exactly what brought me over the top to do it because they said you know what, Tim Ferriss and like you said he seems like a great guy and he’s done amazing stuff. I have nothing against him first, but like when you’re sitting there saying Oh, I was with Richard Branson at the white house the other day. And you know, I’m like, yeah, right, I relate to that. And so that actually helped me to really kind of pick some of the people that I wanted. Because there’s some people in that aren’t who assume that I consider really successful in our business. And I want all of these people are accessible 95% of these people, if you contact them on social media, or through their email, or through their website, they’re gonna get back to you. I truly believe that I have first relationship, but pretty much 99% of the people in this and I truly believe they will get back to you very quickly. And if you went up to them at a seminar you’d be talking for, like, if it was a Greg Rose, or a Dan, John, you might be telling him for a few hours. That’s just the way they are. And so that’s, I’m really glad that you picked up on that, because that was the main driver for me was okay, what how can I be different? And I wanted it to be some, with people that are truly accessible that my people, the people that I’m trying to impact can relate to?

Brett Bartholomew 11:11

Yeah, well, I mean, and I think cuz I related to that, because people said the same thing, when I started the podcast, and I made a choice really early on in the podcast, that I’m not gonna reach out to the same, I understand how these things grow, right? If you want to be and I do like the podcast, this is something I want to do the rest of my life and, I aspire, you know, to have this thing, grow some point where it’s got a Fairest like audience or a Rogen like audience. I think that’s, awesome. Those guys are incredible. But I remember, you know, people saying, well, the way you gotta grow the audience is you’ve got to get these massive names on there, whatever. I’m like, I can appreciate that. And maybe someday I’ll do that. But I just feel like there’s so many other people that haven’t been given a voice. And I feel like there’s so many other people that have unique stories. And I think it just becomes a point in time where it’s like, alright, you know, let’s hear from some other markets. Let’s hear from some other industries. We always talk about being lifelong learners and interdisciplinary. Let’s do that. You know, and just looking at one of the individuals you have, and I always mess up his last name, I shouldn’t and but I’m gonna blame him because he hasn’t reached out in a long time. Mike Ran is it Ranfone, I think

Anthony Renna 12:15

Ranfone. Yeah.

Brett Bartholomew 12:16

So Mike, and I haven’t shared this before. But this is something related to guys. Anthony’s got a part of this book called The be like section. And what I like is he’s not just given kind of like, people in the book aren’t giving just general tips and whatever he actually made everybody give action items. And Mike Ranfone did this for me. So it was right when I first went out on my own. And now I was able to set my own speaking rates, I was able to own my own intellectual property. But I was clueless, I didn’t really have an idea. And I remember Mike reached out. And you know, he said, Hey, I want to have you up. This is before my book came out. He’s like, I’m familiar with your work to a degree, what would you charge for a weekend seminar. And I remember Anthony, I said, you know, like 800 bucks a day, and I thought, like, I was shooting for the stars. And, Mike gave me some of the most valuable he goes, Brett, like, I’ve followed your work. I’ve seen some of the stuff you’ve done. He goes, let me give you some advice, because he laughed at me. He laughed at me on the phone. I was scared shitless that I offended him that I went to high. He goes, he was you have no idea what people in your industry charged do? And I’m like, Well, no, not really. Listen, I worked for a corporation, they said all the rates, we didn’t get a part of that, you know, whatever. And he said, I’ve paid people north of $5,000 that have came in and essentially ended up being charlatans and things like that. He goes, I refuse to pay you less than like, 2500 a day to come up here based on what I know, you’ll deliver. And I was like, holy shit. Like I you know, to this day, I’ve never had an experience like that. I’ve had people consistently try to give me guilt trips of like, well, you should do it for free, whatever this guy is telling me, I should charge him more. And I remember I’m like, Alright, man, well, listen, like, I can’t, I’m not going to charge you that, like, let’s settle it 2000 a day. And you know, he went up and just was so professional. But that was like the value of a book like this for me. And the names like you said, I guarantee a bunch of people wouldn’t know who Mike is. Yet that guy gave me some of the most valuable advice I’ve had in my professional life point blank period. And so I’m glad you did this man. Because if you just went with the big names, whether in our field or any other, nobody would get to learn from people like that.

Anthony Renna 14:27

Yeah, I agree. And you know, with the B likes, what I just tried to do is just take a takeaway that I got from the interview. So you know, let’s, basically it’s 50 interviews with, you know, top fitness professionals and it’s all on success and how they achieved it, and what were the obstacles, maybe how they got through them, etc. And what were some of the habits and traits maybe, and what it was was and this was the challenge for me was, you know, taking something out of that interview even for Brett Bartholomew who the funny thing is right I took with your B like, which is, again, just an action step or challenge based on a takeaway that I got out your is what your be like is the three board schools, right? And so you’ve got that from Nate green. And there’s so much more in your interview. And it was just more about, hey, this stuck out to me. Plus, I have to balance it with all of the other stuff. You know, like everybody else’s be likes, right? But it’s just things that I kind of like that is completely unique to what anybody else has said. He has his own twist on it. And like you said with a Mike Ranfone. There’s so many people in here that people like even a Patrick Ward, I use Patrick as a good example. Because he’s in a high level in our field, he works for the Seattle Seahawks. He’s, he’s gone from having his own place to working at Nike to working for the Seahawks. Right? And that’s the thing is some people who have never heard of him, I doubt he makes a crazy amount of money on that staff, because that’s just in the pros, you don’t usually don’t make that kind of money, which is okay, because that’s not what being successful is about, but we look to Him. As a leader, we look to Him for answers we look to him for, that leadership, and, to see what he’s doing. And I think that was what I tried to accomplish with getting some of these people in there.

Brett Bartholomew 16:23

Yeah, and I want to be like, one of my favorites, easily is, and it’s no surprise because he was an early influence on me. He was one person that, you know, took the time to pick up the phone, he like gave me his phone number and he didn’t need to but Dan, John’s be like was the one I related to the most simply because he said I have one regret. I honestly didn’t celebrate things well enough now as Tiffany his significant other and my friends will tell you, I celebrate all of life’s little victories. And he talks about you know, like write three of your wins down. And I know that sounds really cheesy to some people. But you know, like, here’s the thing. It’s just really hard. If you’re somebody that is dedicated to putting out you know, good content, and you want to do your job well, and you want to be a master craftsman, whatever that means in today’s day and age. And classically, it’s just really easy. Like my parents grew up poor, and they just told me like, never get comfortable, never do this. And I kind of take that to extremes, which is something I’ve done a lot in my life. It’s why I got hospitalized. And it wasn’t probably until a year and a half ago Anthony that I started really doing that and I still suck at it man. Like I had to buy like an Xbox the other week, just and I don’t know the last time I played video games and I really suffered from like, getting my mind off things and I found you know what, it’s not that I’m demotivated to do something it’s that I’m running towards something else. And I realized that like I just wasn’t celebrating some small things enough so my brain was having a hard time detaching from some elements of work and now I celebrate the small shit like I don’t apologize for stuff like my wife and I bought a car that we had been saving up for for a long time and in the past if I showed anybody a new car or new this or new that oh, oh Mr sell out this and that fuck you you know what I mean? Like celebrate the small thing so I think I was really just glad to see stuff like that because so often we can get caught up given the same kind of advice again and again and nobody shares anything super personal. So I like to dance Do you Anthony have anything that like and that you haven’t shared on the book that you haven’t shared on your podcast? Is there anything that you feel like you know is a strong be like for you that maybe nobody would even guests? Even people that know you really well? That they wouldn’t guess that you had struggled with or that you’re like, hey, this is something huge for me.

Anthony Renna 18:45

Yeah, you know, I guess you know, looking at Charlie Weingroff be like okay, and it’s hashtag best in the world. Right? And for some people, they if you don’t really know Charlie, you might think that’s a little arrogant. Okay, and but the way I turned the be like around for that was we have to think bigger. And that is really a big part of my problem is I always you know, I never really think like for example, you said it on the show you want your podcast to be like a Ferris like audience of Rogan like audience and in while you’re saying that I’m saying in my head, I could never get that because I’m too niche into strength and conditioning, right, the strength coach podcast, but that’s the worst way to think and so I always struggle with that. always struggle with those self limiting beliefs about what I’ve done, or what I can do, and I always end up I think, playing a little small Well, because you don’t have that fear of if I go too far and it’s funny because I’ve done things where I failed and you know, whatever I’m very quick to start stuff. So it’s not like I’m afraid to start I started strength in the webinars strengths.com hockey, strength and conditioning, you know, the strength coach podcast, strength coach TV all of these things, my own fitness facility, but I still have this. Okay, this is okay, right here. And that’s why we’re Charlie’s be like, you know, the best. Hashtag best in the world was more about probably my own personal interpretation of that, and what I want for myself, because I feel like, I do see that a lot. We do kind of sit here in this little shallow pool of our, what we’re thinking about what our goals are, what our mission might be. And I think it holds us back.

Brett Bartholomew 21:00

Yeah. And that’s, that touches on exactly what I was hoping you’d get in terms of depth. And it goes kind of into that quote, which it can mean several things, but we don’t see things as they are we see him as we are. And so those tips that resonate with us tend to kind of be ones that assuage or acknowledge some kind of deep seated fear. And listen, man, I’m with you. I understand. We’re both niched to a degree. Now granted, like, I’ve kind of positioned art of coaching. And if people go to the website, they’ll see it. Like, it’s not a strength and conditioning only thing. Neither is his podcast. That being said, we’ve had a hell of a lot of people on the performance space, because I want to serve that audience first. They’re my core, right? And so like, I hear ya , and I think that, like, you know, it may never get to those heights. But you know, if you don’t try, I also think this, like, I have faith, and I think you should to having faith in your audience. I know this strength and conditioning is a very niche audience. But Jesus, it’s passionate, you know. And so I feel like and I just kind of goes into what I want to ask you next, everything evolves. I feel like, you know, there are people at first, like, Oh, this guy’s kind of a pain in the ass. It was a mistake. You know, I can’t believe he’s doing a podcast now. I’m never gonna quit hearing him. And then there’s people that are like, holy shit, this kind of resonates with me. Maybe I’ve changed my mind. And then there’s people like, now I gotta share this with my friends. And I imagine that’s happened to you. In some ventures, too. You already talked about it, where somebody was like, Oh, don’t write a book. Don’t do this. Don’t do that. But we’re already Anthony, have you seen evolution take place, in what you’re doing and how the audience has embraced it? And how do you think that carries over into this book? Like, ultimately, what are people that think it’s just going to be like, Oh, I’m just gonna learn more fitness tips and secrets? What are they going to be surprised to find?

Anthony Renna 22:41

Number one, there is not one fitness thing in this book.

Brett Bartholomew 22:46

I want to make that clear.

Anthony Renna 22:48

Yeah. And so that was a big part of it. Um, yeah, that’s a tough question. I think for me. Understanding and you said it too this is an extremely passionate audience, this community. I mean, it’s, carried me, you know, we’re heading to November 1 will be 12 years at the strength coach podcast is out. Now, there’s an element of first to market for pretty much, you know, that we were, but at the same time, how do you sustain that? Obviously, there’s all these new people coming in. So I think, you know, it really is a hard question to kind of figure like, where that comes from? And where do you go with it? And how far do you take it? But I don’t know. I think for me, one of the things that I really love about what, our community is doing is it really is because they don’t see this in the financial industry. For example, my wife works in the financial industry, talk about people wanting to get better people going places on their own, to get better to, you know, going out to visit gyms going out to mentorships going out to all this continuing education people like my grandfather, who really was getting people like you in there to help his own staff first. Because Michael kept that number. That’s the funny thing like, Well, you didn’t even say was you couldn’t once you got past 35 people, but he wasn’t letting in he goes. But that’s a big place. He could have put 70 people in there made a boatload of money, but this is the way that’s what I love about it. I think that’s a big part of it. I don’t know if that really answers the question. It’s kind of a hard question to kind of, yeah, really mean?

Brett Bartholomew 24:35

And I kind of screwed you with it. But like I asked it, because I want the audience to think about that as well. And you kind of answered it, whether you know it or not, you know, in the beginning of your book, you know, like when people want something to evolve and they want something to take on a life of its own. There’s a certain element of accountability which you address with the be like you talk about that. And then there’s a certain element of autonomy that has to happen where you have to feel like or be empowered to do take these things where you want it. And what I mean is, you talk about, like how to read this book, right? You can read it cover to cover, you can pick some people you want to be like, and they’re interviewed, you can do all this shit. But at the end of the day, you have to digest the information. And I like that you compel people to not be passive, in that digestion. It’s like, hey, like, don’t just sit here and look up like your favorite authors. Like if you want to do that, that’s fine, or your favorite coaches rather. But you know, read everybody and then like, take action, do not just sit there and not take action on what they’re suggesting. Because the unifying theme of the book is the biggest difference is that they take action. And I think that’s how things evolve, something starts off, whether it’s a podcast, or a book, and maybe the first book or the first podcast episodes, not a hit, but you know, maybe it’s the next book or that 100 And first episode of your podcast, it just rolls. And that’s how things evolve by you moving your ass and actually doing something with the information.

Anthony Renna 25:56

Yeah, and what I was really, I was hoping people were going to understand about the book is that these are starters, you know, these are just things that are going to get you started to move to action, it’s not a be all end all? Well, I will say that if you took, if you looked at the B likes, and you took five that you said, I’m having a problem with that area myself, if you took five of them, your life would change, if you really committed to doing five Be likes, your life would change, you would change a lot about the way you’re doing. But at the same time, it’s not like I’m trying to tell you do it only this way, I just want you to commit to some and start it. It’s giving you an idea. And I think that’s what makes the book unique too, in a way is that a lot of books don’t really give you anything beyond, hey, this is the way it should be. Now go out on your own and do it. Now this is kind of giving you a starter. For example, like with you have all the archetypes, that is an easy way to sit in unconscious coaching, it’s an easy way for me to say, Oh, I recognize this guy, I’m going to rip them out. And I’m going to put it here. And when he comes in now I’m going to work with him because that was the point of it to take all of these different coaches talk about the different archetypes. So I the reader can relate to it. Because there’s going to be a couple of archetypes in there that I’m like, oh, that’s Bob. That’s John that Suzy whatever. And I now have a strategy to deal with them. And that’s what not enough books do is they go and they talk about these things. Great. Here’s, the way it should be. But they’re not giving us any kind of movement, or any kind of like, first step towards the action.

Brett Bartholomew 27:46

Yeah, they don’t do that. And then many times they don’t provide context. And I haven’t dealt with that. I’m glad you brought that the archetypes up in conscious coaching. Because I mentioned several times in that book in these podcasts in my online courses, all that like hey, the the archetypes are just there contextual people, are not one dimensional. Right? Like, you can’t just I said it before, in a previous podcast, somebody got mad at me because they’re like, how do I coach, each archetype in every situation I go, well recognize that people are not going to be the same archetype in every situation, right? People act differently when they’re at home, on their couch, it’s a beautiful day outside than they do if a hurricane is hammering them, and they need to evacuate and they need to be aggressive on the road. You know, like you have to see things like in multiple lenses. And with the tips that people in this book provide. You know, you’ve asked them like you ask people like, you know, hey, you’re a high energy person. What cultivated that or hey, you know, you said you journal, what cultivated that it’s not just tip, tip, tip, tip tip do this. It’s alright, let’s talk about a little bit of why I do it. It’s the mess that really kind of this came about, you know, the chaos kind of created clarity situation. So I think that’s something our field misses a lot and is context. I mean, you see what the debates people have with you. And Coach Boyle say one thing, everybody loses their damn mind. But context is just as critical as those action points, is it not?

Anthony Renna 29:11

Yeah, it really is. It really isn’t. I think, you know, sometimes people want to, they look at something and they don’t understand the flexibility of what we’re saying. Right. So like, for example. I think with a lot of people, let’s say could be like, Mike Boyles be like, All right, that I said, Coach Boyle, real attributes a lot of his success to writing and speaking. And a lot of people might say, well, you know, I can’t just get on to perform better tour, you know, it’s hard, and there’s gotta waiting, whatever. And but it’s like, no, no, no, I’m asking you to do that. I’m just asking to start writing. Right? Whatever. You can’t go On Facebook, go on, like, use your status update as your journal, or write, something and then start, doing that. Think about your clients think about some things that you talk about the stuff every day. So start thinking about some shoulder exercises or whatever it may be right and start writing in articles. You don’t get better at writing until you start writing. And then start to submit those there’s a plenty of websites that are looking for articles. And even if they aren’t, again, put it on Facebook, people follow you on Facebook, you have friends on Facebook, they’re gonna start reading somebody’s gonna read it and say, Oh, cool. You this would be a great article. Mike does that all the time? My Contacts people says I love that article you posted on your blog that you know, we could see that six people watch the video and might say can we put it on trinco.com, that’s what happens you have to get yourself out there. So you start writing, you start doing a search or reading an article and then you turn into a lecture lecture to your clients lecture to the why go join the what’s the Toastmasters? Right? Do start to do those little things that are going to start to prepare you it’s not just, Hey, go put your application into the NSCA personal trainer conference and start speaking there. It doesn’t work like that. I think people forget about that flexibility, too. They look at something and they say, Well, I can’t do it like that. And no, no, pick, take this thing, make it work for you.

Brett Bartholomew 31:35

Hey, everybody, we’re gonna get right back into this episode. I don’t want you to miss any of this. But I did want to remind you that as part of the art of coaching audience, if you use the code Brett 20, again, that’s my first name, b r e t t two zero, Brett 20. At checkout at livemomentus.com Anything they have there, you’re gonna get $20 off your first order. If you’re not familiar with Momentus just a reminder, Momentus is the premier sponsor of The Art of coaching podcast. In short, they’re the reason I’m able to bring this information to you guys for free. They helped me cover the cost of the podcast and all the other content that I’m able to get to you guys. So you know, their support is huge. Now, if you’re not familiar with the products, they have a wide range everything from their absolute zero grass fed whey. And again, guys, this is all whey isolate, the purest form of whey ArtFire grass fed whey, not only that they have a 100% plant protein. For those of you they can’t do whey, they have strength recovery, and they’re always coming out with you in new and unique products. Now, one of the reasons I partnered with Momentus is I am a minimalist when it comes to any of this stuff. I’m a big believer that consistency in your training, sleep, hydration and just good nutrition are the most powerful supplements. But there are certain staples that we can’t get around. And we have to be able to source in the most responsible way possible. And that we also have to just be able to add in through supplementary form whether that’s because we’re busy lifestyles because we have digestion issues, any number of factors. And so, you know, protein and fish oil is really the only thing that I take every now and then I might experiment with some other stuff that’s all natural, but I’m from the Midwest. So there’s a running joke that we kind of grew up on steak and milk. But Momentus is absolutely something I’m behind 100%. And again, if you just use the code, Brett 20, at anything on livemomentus.com. Or you can check out The Art of coaching Momentus link on the show notes. You’re going to be hooked up. Thanks again for your support. And now back to the episode.

Yeah, and I think collecting those breadcrumbs. I mean, that was a prime example of I shot too big when I probably reached out to you back in the day in 2008, which is why I think it was 2009. I wrote and you brought up Coach Boyle and strengthcoach.com, I had wrote an article called talking in color. And this was he was kind enough to feature it or maybe you featured it, whoever I’m grateful. And it was about, you know, I was studying attentional focus, right. Everybody’s heard enough about internal and external cueing. That was what I was studying at the time. And I hadn’t heard anybody talk about it, speak about it. So I’m like, well, listen, this is interesting to me. Like, I think there’s something here, let’s go with it. And that ended up actually being foundational to what eventually became conscious coaching because I was like, hmm, if just cues can elicit certain kinds of responses. What else influences behavior? What else does this and then I started writing, conscious coaching. And then I saw other people start, you know, I think attentional focus started taking off later, more like the mainstream a few years later. And it was just all these little breadcrumbs lead to something. And, you know, I’m not like Coach Boyle in the fact that I’m not a prolific writer. It was nice that you call me that in our interview, but my journal like I always like Seth Godin. He’s very simple. It’s really just boom, boom, boom. So for me my to Instagram feed became that now, that was also a double edged sword, Anthony, because then there are some people that they think all my stuff is just what I share on Instagram. And I’m like, No, that’s 1%. Like, if you want more in depth stuff, you got to go other places. So talk to me about how like relieving it is to you to now have a centralized resource yet another one, that if somebody says, Hey, man, what about this? Hey, I have a question. What about this? Isn’t it a relief to be able to be like, Yo, here’s the book.

Anthony Renna 35:29

Yeah, it really is. Because we, you know, I think, as you know, people get to a certain point where, okay, I have my CSCs. And I’ve been to this mentorship and that mentorship, and I have this, you know, the DVR T cert and kettlebell cert, so the exercise stuff becomes, okay, how much more can I do? And you know, you still want to keep up with that stuff? And I certainly do. But I don’t get crazy, like the first four or five years, I was crazy with it, right. And so these are the questions that start to come in. And that’s what I was going to say earlier, when you were talking about what you were writing, and you put on Instagram, not to remember, if you don’t put it out there, you’re not going to know what the people want. All of a sudden, you’re thinking, Whoa, wait a minute, I got a great response to this. It’s amazing, this is something that you need to maybe jump into a little bit more, I need to talk more about this, this is something that I can help people with. And that’s why it’s important to kind of keep putting yourself out there. But yeah, this is for me, because this is a lot of, you know, for a lot of people that would would listen to the podcast would say, Man, I tried to do a podcast and I tried to do this, but I feel like I don’t have time and I have this and that and we have training. And that’s just a bad excuse. Because we’re we’re just managing our time. We’re not really managing our time well, and I really truly believe that starts at the top. And that’s with like, a mission and purpose. And then that leads to what are your values and this idea, like goals will start to lead. That’s why we have we probably have, I think I have eight kind of or nine goal related Be likes in there, right? I have four or five, kind of mission, purpose, life vision, Be likes, then there’s scheduling and productivity. There’s another 10 or 15, and personal development and a relationship. Different be like so, it covers so many, you know, Fred too one thing everybody always says it’s funny. I went to functional strength coach seven and I posted while Mike was speaking, he had posted like 15 books in a matter of I don’t know, two hours. And I posted Hey, Coach Boyles recommended you know, all these, you know, so many books today. Wow. And I got so much response. What books are they? What books are they? You know, so many people wanted those resources, they wanted those things, they want to get better? And I think that’s what I liked about this is that, like you said, it’s a nice way to be like, Oh, go to this, read this interview. See how he did this? And try this be like, try to do that. Get a starter, and let’s move from there.

Brett Bartholomew 38:25

Yeah, and like with that, I mean, you’ve talked several times about, hey, this is a starter, this is an action point, this is something you need to do next, when it came to getting this book created. Can you walk us through what that process was? Like? I know, you use a publisher user read Draper. Like for me, I self published. You know, either process is never a lot of fun. And there’s so much resistance. You mentioned Steven Pressfield, who’s one of my top three favorite authors. Can you talk to me about what even getting this thing together was like weather the orchestration of getting everybody you interviewed? And then even to the print and production from root to the fruit? What were some things you had to overcome and some shit that you thought like, Is this ever gonna come out?

Anthony Renna 39:13

Yeah, yeah, I mean, first of all, just this idea of okay, how do I make this? Not this, next 45 interviews, not a specific completely different interview with each person because that just isn’t gonna work. Because now I have to know so much about everybody in their journey and every little detail and is no accurate to pull that off unless it was a two or three year or three, three or four year book project two or three year two years just getting the research done. So for me, it was like What are some of the best question, what are some things that people want to know what are things some things that I want to know about people and how they got there? That was Number one, how do I do that first? So I kind of came up with these questions that were possibilities that I came up with. All right, cool, what’s a list and I probably had 55 or 60 people and tried to keep it, okay. This one’s a doctor, and I wanted to make sure I had good female representation in there. And I wanted to make sure I had some professionals, strength coaches in there, maybe, and some people who are no longer training, you know, aren’t really you know, have done their work. And now we’re doing other things that may be coaching and that type of thing. So I really, I tried to, like, I just started listening people, I went to, like social media, and just like, Okay, where are my friends here? You know, and, it just went down the line and write their name. I had like a big whiteboard in my office, I just kept writing before I decided, I said, Okay, first we’re gonna do, you know, let’s do it that way. And then, you know, I had the questions, I had the people. And then it was a matter of just having the right tools, like Calendly is a great app for me to kind of, I could put all the questions in there, and I could send this email out to everybody I did, you know, in Google Mail, I just did a canned response where I just put it in, boom, hey, blank, I’m writing a book, here’s what it’s gonna look like, this is what the working title is, here’s some of the questions and blah, blah, blah. And I sent it out to the people that I wanted. And it was really easy only because, again, I’ve been doing this for so long, that a lot of people, I don’t want to say they owed it to me, but they were like, shit, you know, and, put me on the show a couple times. Of course, I gotta go on, you know, almost even if they didn’t, but everybody responded really quickly. And again, these are all people that are really into helping other people. So they want to get that word, though, you know, that piece out there for other people to hear. So it was a pretty no brainer, but it did take me about five months to get That other 45. And then that was all the easy part. Because I had to get them transcribed. And the transcription process is not perfect. Put it that way. And then even when you hear an interview, it’s like, oh, wow, that sounded great. That was a great interview. Wow. But if we got this transcript, and then we didn’t edit it, people would be like, these two guys are idiots.

Brett Bartholomew 42:27

Oh, yeah. editing, is such a great. I hired two editors. For my book, I had a content like a syntax editor to make sure like, hey, was there anything redundant, repetitive, and then we also had somebody that, you know, worked with the grammar space. And then the irony is, when he when I uploaded these things to like, I don’t know, Kindle and whatever. Sometimes it would Kindle their platform would screw it up, and it would create grammatical errors that weren’t even there. Because you had to use their platform like are you doing? Is this going to be Kindle and audible as well as it’s going to be just a primary hard copy? Like it were? What ways is will this be available to the masses?

Anthony Renna 43:04

Yeah, well, that’s what’s great about what I did is I didn’t have to worry about that piece of it. Right? Because I. Yeah, on January 1, when I knew I had all my people kind of in there, right. I knew the 50 people, they said they were going to do it. Bla bla bla, I sent him an email. Actually, I first I listened to Michael Hyatt program called get published. And at the end of the day, nobody cares. This from a guy who was the CEO of Thomas Nelson, nobody, these publishers don’t care about the content. They want to know. How are you going to market this? How are you going to get it out there? Is it a Good Idea number one, obviously, they want to make sure it’s relevant. But at the same time, I you know, Larry knows, I have a podcast with a bunch of listeners that we’ve been doing for a long time, and having 50 people in there, okay, let’s say 50% of the people helped me out, I still have 25 people that are going to spread the word on October 10, through the 18th and beyond. And she knew I had a platform to get this out there. That’s a really important thing for a publisher because they don’t want to sit there. They’re not gonna spend all this money marketing for you. You have to really push this through a lot of the work start getting on podcast working this whole works, keep working it so with Laurie having the Laurrie I am so thankful because yes, it is going on Kindle. We’re gonna have a PDF, you know, PDF version as well, Kindle and hardcopy obviously, not hardcover, but you know, actual book and thank God that I didn’t do this myself because I wouldn’t have been prepared for what was coming. The editing process was I had my one of my clients helped me with the transcripts. And so I had somebody transcribe it from the transcriptions and then I had somebody read it to kind of work with some of the grammatical errors. And then I would edit it. And then I sent it to Laurie. And that first piece of it. She’s obviously got a lot of experience with this. It’s not our first rodeo. Because all the Dan John books, Mike Boyle look great cookbooks, whatever. And that’s what’s been, it made this process go 30 times easier than it should have been. But there is no audiobook because it wouldn’t be a little weird. Just reading other people’s, you know, these were original interviews, which we’re going to release some of them as bonuses, etc. But, yeah, it would be weird to be, you know, doing that.

Brett Bartholomew 45:42

Yeah, no, I remember. I mean, that was even tough with the archetype section of my book, you know, we had hired and this was a whole nother thing.

Anthony Renna 45:49

I text you on this?

Brett Bartholomew 45:50

Yeah. People always endlessly. They’re like, Oh, why didn’t you narrate it? And I have to, like, have them pause and be like, Hey, listen, again, big authors, like their publishers pay for studio time, and recording time and recording equipment. Audible has really, really, because I was initially gonna read it. And I would have done it all in one voice, for better or worse, but audible send you back this thing. It’s like, hey, if this is gonna get approved, it’s got to be consistent at this decibel level, we can’t hear you even do. Like, take a breath, you have to edit it, you know, and I’m like, Jesus, it’s already like another 2500 to get it on Audible. And then I’ve got to pay for recording equipment that I didn’t have at the time. And then I’ve got to learn how to use editing software, or pay somebody to do that. And by that time, I think I had sunk 20 grand into the damn book. And so, you know, audible was like, Well, don’t worry, like, we have people that do this professionally. So you know, my wife and I, we spent one day and I think I talked about this on the podcast once, you had to upload a script, right? So let’s say you upload a Dave tenis be like, and all his stuff and, and all that or you just uploaded a huge PDF, in general of your book. Then what happens is the next morning, you get like 300 or 400 people who basically apply to read your book, and you’ve got to listen to how all of them, you know, read it. And so we found a guy that we thought was straightforward. Like, he sounds like Henry Cavill to me, the guy that played Superman, but then he got wacky and started doing accents. Oh, the Australian accent this, that whatever. And you know what I thought at first I was like, My heart went into my throat. I’m like, why did he do this? And then I’m like, You know what, that’s actually pretty funny. It like the guy is funny, because he listened to the interview, he thought enough, I have to appreciate the professionalism. He listened to the interviews of the people and God bless him even though he didn’t nail all their accents. If they had one, he tried and I can get that it could get boring or or to hear the same voice you know, all the time. But that goes into another thing. I thought you organize this really well. I loved how at the end and you frame this up even before the introduction like in the table of contents, you don’t just have the body of everything. Anthony, you have the index, you know, within be like the best you have the books everybody recommended. So like, nobody has to like be like, oh shit, who recommended that book, like you have the index of be likes the books recommended. All the people referenced like, why did you do it that way? Is there been something that like you read in other books that you wish they would have done that? Or is are you OCD? What what made that Why’d you do that with this book?

Anthony Renna 48:15

Yeah, just consulting with Laurie, we kind of felt like, number one, no, people I knew like me as a reader, how am I going to approach this book? I’m going to look at the list. And I might be like, Oh, Brett, Bartholomew, I want to read him. And then I might say, after reading the intro, oh, you know what, though? I want to, I have a few things that I’m really struggling with. So how do I find out? And that’s where the B likes come in. Right? So okay, cool. Jason firouzja talks about building relationships. I’m gonna go there first, because I’m really struggling with that. And I really want to build my now. So I felt like that was a good way to do it in terms of how do I give people the most opportunity to find what they’re looking for? And then the books? Yeah, I mean, we do that so much. I’d like I said, after going to functional strength, coach especially, and everybody’s freaking out. Well, folks, are they where are they? What is he talking about? Who’s the author for this one, I was like, wow, people are freaking out over this. So it was one of those things, like I said, you know, you start to learn the questions that people are asking, and you want to answer those. So I was trying to answer those things. First, but you know, before they asked them, Okay, well, you know, do you have a so I didn’t have to go to a website and say, Oh, now now he wants me to click on a website and go find it there. So that’s kind of why we wanted to do and the the names that people listed. That’s just what Laurie. That’s what she normally does. She was mentioned in the book. So but the rest of it was kind of like we were thinking like, Hey, this is how you’re gonna read the book. And this is I want people to find it and I hate telling people what to do. That’s why I like Even with my podcasts, I always say, Okay, I’m gonna have Brett on, I’m not going to challenge Brett. I’m going to ask him questions so people can make form an opinion about him and say, You know what, I want to go find more about Brett or I don’t like what Brett has to say, I don’t really chime in

Brett Bartholomew 50:18

There’s lot of those people. There’s a lot of those people.

Anthony Renna 50:21

Yeah. And there’s a few podcasts out there that the guys are brilliant. And I love them. But it’s almost about them. And my client used to give me a hard time she said, Oh, you need to be talking about yourself more. And I’m like, No, it’s not about me. It really isn’t. It’s not about me, I want the person who’s talking. And that’s why I never really give a big intro or talk about, hey, Brett tell me all about your life. You know, obviously less. You know, let’s tell us about that story. When you were in the hospital, because that was relevant to the story, right? But not, hey, I was born young. You know, it was a rainy day back in 1967. You know, it was just

Brett Bartholomew 50:55

And then the no film No, our music starts playing it was a rainy day. And there was a damsel in the street. Yeah, no, I agree, man. I think like, it’s a conversation. I mean, there’s definitely some episodes, people could say, Hey, you talk too damn much. And then there’s some where people were like, Hey, you didn’t talk enough. And what I found is just people generally, you know, it goes back and forth. I tried to make it a conversation. I don’t look at it as an interview as much as a conversation. You know, but that’s everybody’s style. And that’s why there’s a million different podcast things out there. You know, looking at the release of this, and this is something I wish I had done, I was freaking clueless when I did my book, I probably just didn’t, I mean, one, I didn’t have a team of people, I didn’t have any of that kind of stuff. I didn’t really have a platform at the time, because that just wasn’t allowed where I’d been prior. But you know, you’re smart man you’re doing you know, you can get pre launch bonuses updates. I had to figure all this stuff out kind of as I went, of course, I tried to scour, you know what other people had done, but I just I didn’t have the resources financially or anything, or the purse, because I knew like, I was like, how am I going to kind of get the word out of this. But I know one thing you had sent me a long time ago, and it was helpful is just like, people being able to go to belikethe best.com. And boom, like, they’re gonna get pre launch bonuses, they’re gonna get a firsthand look at the book, what are some of those bonuses that people can get? And if they go to belikethebest.com? Why is it worth their time?

Anthony Renna 52:19

Well, number one, you’re going to order it in the pre in the pre launch, you’re gonna order it, we’re gonna send you that, not sure if it’s the Kindle version, or the PDF version right away, so you’re gonna get something right away to start on this. So we’re doing another book, and this is gonna sound like bullshit, but it’s not for the money. It’s for people. And I thought, what else would I want with this book, I would want a workbook. So there’s going to be a be like workbook that people are also going to get as a bonus if they, buy it during the pre launch, because we’re going to set that’s only going to be a PDF seek, like, let’s say you go to Brett’s be like, and there’s some different things that we’re going to say if you want to write it down, you don’t want to write in the book, you can just print it out on this. And we’re going to do it a little bit differently than the be like, we’re going to add some stuff to each be like, for the workbook. So you’ll get the PDF right away, you’ll get the workbook right away. And that for me was a really big deal. Because we felt like what else can we give people that are really going to help them I don’t want just and we have a couple more that we’re working on with that. I really can’t say right now. But like when I asked everybody, Hey, is there something that you want to throw in? So but I felt like how do I help people the most, and I felt like the workbook was something like somebody might want this. So we’re gonna do a hard copy through Amazon and just, you know, we’re not printing it out ahead of time, we’re just doing it through Amazon, it’s going to be print on demand. But it’s something that people can write in, but we’re gonna give you guys that as the PDF, if you pre launch, if you buy it during the pre launch as well, because we felt like, this is something that people are really, we want people to take action on, right? We want people to really take these be likes to heart and say, Okay, I’m going to commit to this be like I’m gonna do it, I’m gonna do whatever I can to do it. And so that was really important for me from when I did this, you know, like, you and I have talked about a million times like, I just don’t want to be full of shit. And just be like, Oh, hey, get this something that no one’s ever going to use. And then we’re also going to get some of the interviews, the the actual audio interviews, because all of these are, you know, they’re pared down. There’s 50. If we can edit these, there would be this book would be like 800 pages, right? So we just didn’t want to do that. So we were going to havea bunch of audio files. And if people sign up, they’re already getting five, your original five and then we’re going to add like, depending on what it is five to two Add more for people to listen to while they’re waiting. And you know, to go a little bit deeper because again, we added them, we added them. So and again, just maybe a few more bonuses after that.

Brett Bartholomew 55:12

Yeah, it’s smart. I mean, and speaking of bullshit, you mentioned that term, anybody and to go back to you saying, hey, it’s not about the money, anybody that thinks you make a bunch of money writing a book, I encourage you to write a book, write a book, and see how much money you do not make from writing a book. You know, it’s fascinating to me, I mean, even the big huge monumental authors will tell you, you do not make money from writing a book and be like, the royalties and this and that, it’s always just a mess. It’s a nightmare. And so like, if somebody says, Oh, here we go, somebody writing a book gonna get rich with screw them. That’s not what happens here at all. And, you’re smart to give away the workbook. I mean, that’s why I did the field guide. Like we gave away a free conscious coaching Field Guide, and people still can download that like, and because it’s funny, you mentioned it, man, and I don’t know what it is, I don’t know how we’re gonna fix it. I think it’s just part human nature. People just don’t want to take action. I mean, the reality is, is there’s people that probably listen to the first 10 minutes of this interview, and they’re like, man, something else see, you know, but the point is, is if you want to be like the best and you want to do these things, however you define the best however you define improvement, your ass is gonna have to get to work and overcome the resistance. So I think that’s critical man, and, and it coming out in October, and I encourage everybody, definitely go to belikethebest.com. Everything’s going to be in the show notes. But don’t doddle on this stuff. Like there’s no, like, how much is this going to be? How much is book costs?

Anthony Renna 56:44

Um, 20 a pitcher 24. We wanted to keep it in a good number where it wasn’t really said no, don’t go to like the 29.95 kept it down. So pretty sure it was 24 24.95.

Brett Bartholomew 56:58

Yeah, here’s the thing, guys, and you know, me, like if you listen to this podcast a lot, I’m pretty no bullshit. You’re spending $24 on something in the next few weeks anyway. And if you can’t get an idea from this book, or something, or peace of mind, that gives you at least five times that value, then let’s just say you’ve got other areas of your life that you’ve really got to focus on. And I know that sounds rude. But you know, this is a podcast that we compel people to take action because we can all kind of just you play the victim and curmudgeon card all we want, nothing’s gonna happen. And is there anything I miss man? I mean, again, like you said, we could go for two hours and go down the litany of people that, wrote pieces in here, but I want to make sure that we gave everybody a full taste and the flavor of this thing, what else brother?

Anthony Renna 57:43

No, you know, I just kind of push more into this action idea. I think you’re right, in terms of we I don’t know why we do we’re afraid of something right. What’s that?

Brett Bartholomew 58:00

I think you said in the book, though, it’s eight to the age of information. So maybe it’s just the crippling effect of too much information.

Anthony Renna 58:06

Yeah, that is a problem. Like we start to, like we want to be part of all of these things. So we kind of dabble. And we don’t pick one, we don’t focus on one. And I’m not saying like, if you’re reading range, right now, you’re gonna say what you can’t pick one. Yeah, you can pick one like we do in the book, hey, take this goal. 30 days, 30 day immersion. That’s it. That’s all you’re gonna think about. It’s 30 days, you’re gonna be an expert in that topic. And then you’re gonna decide, Is it for me pick another one in a couple of months, another 30 day immersion. So that’s part of the problem. You’re right is that age of information, but I think we don’t take action, we’re afraid of something. And also, I heard a great quote by a guy named Ray Edwards, who’s a copywriter that I keep talking about. And one of the things that really inspired me to kind of make sure that I did this was he said, Listen, there’s people out there that can only hear your voice. And that should inspire everybody to go out there and to create, to do a podcast, we don’t have enough podcasts. I don’t care what anybody says, There are not enough podcasts out there. Somebody out there needs to hear your voice. That’s why you need to write. That’s why you need to make some videos. That’s why you try to do a podcast, keep pushing, keep thinking, remember that there’s people out there that can only hear your voice and that for me, that helped me take action on something like this. So I do. I think that’s why, you know, you finish so strongly with tires, because it’s a huge problem. And you know, like, Guys, get out there because the people don’t last in this industry, because we can’t make it just on this training alone. We need other things. And it’s okay to make some money.

Brett Bartholomew 59:53

Yeah, no, I agree, man. I agree. Well, I appreciate you coming on the show. But more importantly, Anthony, I appreciate you putting out more and more resources. for everybody to learn from. And guys, as always, if you’re not a strength and conditioning coach, you’re in the performance realm. Remember, this is all interdisciplinary, like you’re learning from people at the end of the day. And this isn’t something that’s a niche specific, like even if somebody talks about their gym, chances are you own a business or a side hustle or something else, or it relates to your family. So like, think bigger, think more broadly, and focus on taking the core of what the messages are in this book, and put them to use Anthony, I really appreciate you, man and everything that you do. And thanks for continuing to do this stuff for us.

Anthony Renna 1:00:34

Hey, Brad, thank you. It’s been an honor, it’s been first of all, it’s been so great to watch you rise over these years and, and be part of the strength coach, podcast and things that I’ve been doing. And thank you so much for being part of this book. Because it really was such a value, everybody’s piece was so valuable. And it offers perspective from so many different people. And I really appreciate you not only being in the book, but having me on your show. So thanks. Thank you.

Brett Bartholomew 1:01:02

My pleasure, guys can be like the best October 18. Sign up for more pre launch bonuses. All these things are in the show notes, write it down, write it down, write it down, set an alarm and a reminder on your phone. And then please support authors and people like Anthony Renna. I know I belabor this a lot, because I’m an independently published author. But guys, the Amazon reviews, there’s always just random people out there that are angry, and they’ll leave reviews that are not even relevant. And so you know, people like me and Anthony never pander for fake reviews, anything like that. But just write an honest review and spread the word about the book that helps so much. So until next time, guys, take it easy, and this has been the art of coaching podcast.

Oh, you’re still listening. Listen, I’m glad that you stuck around for a little bit. I want to make sure you guys know about the newsletter that I put out each month. I’m not somebody that tries to inundate your inbox or anything like that. So you don’t have to worry you’re not going to hear from me every day. I have a job and family responsibilities much like all of you, but I do put out a newsletter that has helpful links. It’ll showcase new episodes, new events, it’ll tell you where I’m gonna be and and what I’m going to be speaking on. So if you’re interested, make sure to go to the show notes. Or you can go to artofcoaching.com/start. Again, that’s artofcoaching.com/start, join the newsletter. It is the absolute best way to stay up to date with everything. I announced anything I do there first. It always gets announced through the newsletter first and then social media and everything else. So artofcoaching.com/start and again, I hope you guys enjoyed this episode. Appreciate you joining me

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